The Flight . The belligerent behavior of the pilot with the controller and the sound of his voice makes me wonder if this might have been suffering from mild hypoxia. Looks like we found the co-owner of Wife Approved, LLC. Don't argue with these pros. I will answer the question exactly as written: > When ATC has you call. The controller states that the pilot needs clearance to be in Bravo and to have requested clearance. - hold until otherwise instructed My reliable bet is that sometime between approach switching the aircraft to tower and the time the phone number is read, the pilot gave the tower controller a sob story. Thank you. Maybe, just maybe this controller was playing her Bravo authority a little too far? I noticed a typo "pilot deviation" should be of course "pilot deviation". Interceptions are dangerous and that jet blast and thrust from either twin thrust (F-15) or single thrust (F-16) could put the Cessna into a dangerous condition. He shouldnt be flying anywhere near Class B airspace if he doesnt understand the regulations. 2 Letter from FAA notifying an investigation is underway, privileges may be suspended or curtailed until investigation is over. Hey not fair to say that to PIA. The other pilot had it right - he's a real a*&^. If youre having medical issues or youre feeling unwell youre not supposed to be in command of an aircaft. N731NR Aircraft Registration - FlightAware Good for the controller for remaining reasonable. 866.835.5322 (866-TELL-FAA)Contact Us, United States Department of Transportation, Aviation Safety Draft Documents Open for Comment, Airport Coronavirus Response Grant Program, Legislation & Policies, Regulations & Guidance, Certificated Remote Pilots including Commercial Operators, Recreational Flyers & Modeler Community-Based Organizations, Archived Quarterly Enforcement Reports (These reports date back to the first quarter of 1997. Harrison Ford is an accomplished pilot that made the same sort of mistake that many Commercial ATP pilots have made setting up for the wrong runway or taxiway etc. To do this, they will use the Brasher Notification Phraseology. Dad got home that night after his charter. This guy is a class-one "all about me" narcissist who makes GA pilots look bad. They don't take airspace incursions lightly, ESPECIALLY in the #8 most busy airport in the US. 731NR | Pilots of America Home Forums Controlled Airspace Flight Following 731NR Discussion in ' Flight Following ' started by WWFeldman, Oct 29, 2020 . Please provide this information by COB, on Friday July 17, 2020, or we will go with the last known requestor from MuckRock.com, who we are showing as Matthew Phelan. 3h 18m. Neil Wilsonthe CFIIsays "maybe the controller was playing her class BRAVO authority a little too far".. You should not be a CFII with that kind of attitude. BTW to the ATC controller who explained workload issues during handoff - thank you!! What would the discussion be today if there had been a midair collision like the one in San Diego in 1979 with the PSA 727 and a Cessna? [His lack of permission and knowledge about needing such was discussed by previous posters and is referenced here just for completeness.]. For the next month Dad did at least one flight with all of IPs students to check on his teaching ability. Cut off a commercial airline at the beginning of his short final resulting in a missed approach and go round for him. I don't care where people get frustrated. Most aircraft are owned by a business, a corporation, a leasing company, or someone who rents their aircraft out. It causes paperwork (at the very least) on both sides and is also distracting from other important duties. This isnt a slap on the wrist type of offense. He did request a clearance. Best Flight Tracker: Live Tracking Maps, Flight Status, and Airport Delays for airline flights, private/GA flights, and airports. Subject: FOIA 2020-007191WP DUE: 8/6/2020, 411A Highland AvenueSomerville, MA 02144-2516, Subject: Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) Request 2020-007191WP. It's clear the supe was not impressed by how the controller handled the situation either. When approach calls tower about a deviation, they may or may not give details. He just flat out refused. (Apologies if external links aren't allowed.). He should not even be allowed to control his own [emailprotected]. This is why the controller is denying entry into Bravo space. It will get figured out. ). How Much Does It Cost To Become A Flight Instructor? It will get figured out. Or, the guy may be a massive jerk. I too am amazed at the next tower's apology. I drove IP the 95 miles to FSD and he had a session with the controller and the supervisor. @Wingslover said, "If youre having medical issues or youre feeling unwell youre not supposed to be in command of an aircraft.". Go read the news HERE AND NOW and find out when we call the cops with the .50 BMGs to take out one guy going to the store because he looks "suspicious".*. Then you are free to call the tower on the landline when you land and find out why you were denied clearance or complain about poor services. Anyone flying under VFR (Visual . E Pull that @$$holes license and give him a huge fine. I know this Controller and she is good at her job. I hope he stops making bad decisions before he no longer has the ability to do so. The magic words that should raise the hairs on the back of your neck are "possible pilot deviation." It goes without saying that you should remain vigilant as you fly around the national. Everything is on tape. Get the stick out of your asses. Car accidents because of human error are just as fatal only to less people. If N1NR had requested clearance, ATC would have responded with clearance or denial and N1NR would have to confirm what was said. Good luck. Its ridiculous that youre allowed to take the control of a Cessna independently at 60-80 hours of learning. Or . I'm a commercial pilot and CFII. All I do is shake my head and smile. N1NR answers back that "he's flying". But I'd recommend against posting it, even if that person turns out to be the idiot in question. Entitled pilot violates airspace, argues with Air Traffic controller Anarchists on the ground, anarchists in the air. If N1NR requested clearance but did not hear back from ATC, they would have to repeat the request as they cannot assume what ATC heard; however, it is highly unlikely that even if ATC heard the request they would allow N1NR clearance into Bravo. 552. Then landed on the beach. Not only is it against our good nature, but its more work to deviate a pilot (tell on them in lay terms) than to overlook trivial pilot errors after calling them out, as long as it doesnt pose an imminent danger. Turns out he's a slumlord, "supplement" pill pusher, and owns a "wealth generation" company. Unless there is an emergency, no person should operate an aircraft contrary to an ATC instruction. In fact, I encourage that. There must be zero tolerance. Once I had to reroute a general aviation pilot around weather to miss other traffic and he would not do it, Finally I was told to Once I had to reroute a general aviation pilot around weather to miss other traffic and he would not do it, Finally I was told to ask him "are you refusing an air traffic control clearance?" The pilot never requested clearance into the class BRAVO airspace. he just kept right on going disregarding the safety of hundreds of people on the SWA planes. Happens every day, but not usually with the drama that this knucklehead exhibited A few weeks ago a commercial pilot blew through the O'hare Bravo - ATC kept trying to gently help him by repeating the local altimeter reading thinking he might check his altitude by the 3rd time he offered it, but eventually just had to notify the errant pilot and provide him with a phone # to call. Enforcement Reports | Federal Aviation Administration Air traffic controllers are susceptible to power trips and moods and biases, just like everyone else. I'll give you the number when you're ready to copy." . You'd be surprised how many Pilots act like they are the only plane an ATC is working even tho she is nonstop talking sequencing Arrivals to one of the top 5 busiest airports in the USA!!! Have you ever said That's a terrible thing to say, that a pilot should lose his license. > Good job on hitting a new high USA! If the worst were to happen, people could lose their lives due to pilot deviation, which is not something that anyone wants to have on their conscience. For those that don't want to read. No one commented on the commercial airliner that had to deviate (immediate drop in altitude) from his glide path when he got a visual on the offending email plane. What else could you expect? The pilots is always in command, not the controller. Pilot deviation is a serious mistake to make when you are piloting a plane, and the consequences could be disastrous. I would have made up some BS like instruments or alternator. Humans make mistakes sometimes its not a reason to bully somebody. Whether medical or not, whether deserving of sympathy or not, I hope this guy loses his license. Caller - is he available, It is quite apparent that the pilot is well versed in being an a**hole. LOL this is probably the same guy that registered the aircraft to WIFE APPROVED LLC. Instructions on distribution of The Original Donna: Class Bravo & Charlie airspace requires certain verbal permission to fly in/out/ and through it, but you have basic lack of understanding when it comes to the airspace system I fear. Every pilot has equal access to the airspace system and have Maybe follow-up later with a phone call to make sure they knew it was entirely unintentional, you immediately corrected the error, and that safety is paramount. For starters, she let him wander into bravo and didn't kick him out until he was well inside. Thank you, number as soon as IP returns will have him call. I received a disc from the FAA containing the Air Traffic Organization response and I loaded everything from that disc into this Google Drive folder. After that Dad called a friend in the FAA out of the STP and reported the now private pilot as a hazzard and requested a re examination. The Federal Aviation Administration publishes quarterly a compilation of enforcement actions against regulated aviation entities that are closed with either a civil penalty or issuance of a certificate suspension or revocation. I have to say the VASAviation guts who make these videos to an awesome job, its really cool how they combine the audio with the radar detail. would argue at times. And an ATP should be a few thousand. She was far better to him than a lot of NY approach controllers are to good pilots on a good day (and I like NY approach, by the way). ALL pilots know you have to hear the magic words, Cleared into Brovo. Gotta love how times have changed Dad was a FBO, Commercial, Instructor, Multi, Aerobatic, crop duster and Instrument. Reminds me of center frequencies ignoring calls from VFR aircraft. Anyway, a video has just been uploaded of an interaction between an air traffic controller and a pilot over the skies of Las Vegas on June 20, 2020. Time that controller needed for other pilots who HAD to be in the Class B. I can't believe anyone would defend his behavior Is it that hard to skirt around or over it? His license should be permanently revoked. However he failed to descend below the inner ring, that ring starts at 4500 ft MSL and goes up to 10000 ft MSL. Is there an issue? So long "Karen". This guys ego trip does not trump the lives of the flying public and those on the ground who live under the pattern. That's no cause to kill him. What would the discussion be today if there had been a midair collision like the one in San Diego in 1979 with the PSA 727 and a Cessna? I was really busy at the time and he took up much of my time and reduced the safe operation of the airspace. I, at times, if the weather is good enough, cancelled IFR..continuing on my own. None of my students have gotten one either. If the pilot is unsure of an ATC clearance, they can simply request clarification from ATC. This is usually in the following format: (Aircraft identification) POSSIBLE PILOT DEVIATION, ADVISE YOU CONTACT (facility) AT (telephone number). People get frustrated in the air just like they do in cars and dont get their license suspended. The pilot will most likely face a license suspension and other penalties. NASTY ARGUMENT between Cessna Pilot and Vegas ATC! Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. If an ATC clearance has been obtained, there is no pilot that is allowed to deviate from the given clearance unless an amended clearance has been obtained, there is an emergency, or the deviation is in response to an air traffic alert and collision avoidance system resolution advisory. N731NR (still whining): "I've asked for clearance multiple times. In aviation, Bravo airspace or Class B space is a zone around some of the busiest airports that no plane or helicopter is allowed to enter without permission. Unfortunately, that's not what happened. He flew straight to KHND like he owned the sky. Not saying that he should yell at him, but apologizing seemed a bit odd. 07-Oct-2022. ATC Audio: Negligent Pilot Argues With Air Traffic Controller, I love listening to air traffic control audio, Not Good: Boom Overture Left Without Engines, Factorydesigns Innovative New Narrow Body Business Class Seat, Please view our advertising policy page for additional details about our partners. For this pilot (tail number N731NR abbreviated to N1NR), it wasn't a mistake as noted by the following exchange: LAS Approach: "N1NR, I need you outside of the Bravo"N731NR: "Negative"LAS: "Negative what? MuckRock users can file, duplicate, track, and share public records requests - refusing to take down a number because "busy flying" Humans make mistakes sometimes its not a reason to bully somebody. He SHOULD lose his cert for Thanks to anyone who knows. I'm only going this way because something in his demeanor smells like something else is at play. Been there, done that. The problem is with dangerous attitude. This guy is a real threat to himself and others. LAS: "You have to have a Bravo clearance. Sincerely,Annjanette CumminsNational FOIA Coordinator for ANM, AAL & AWP RegionsFOIA Program Management Branch, AFN-400(206) 231-2034[AFN3_SignatureImage_2a]. The wheels of justice grind slowly but they do grind - Ken White (a lawyer and a good one). We all know the pilot was wrong but. maybe he's tired of the attitude of that particular class bravo. It's hard to begin to defend such irrational and reckless behavior. But Id recommend against posting it, even if that person turns out to be the idiot in question. This guy intentionally violated it, then took up ATC's time fighting about it. Assuming N1NR requested clearance, in standard aviation communications, there is a clear protocol. Next morning he called student and flew with him back to FSD did 3 practice approaches with touch and go with the last being a full stop. Maybe on a subconscious level, you realize that there are departures off of Runway 27R as well. (at least formally) Pull that @$$holes license and give him a huge fine. Must have been a Kennedy. No request for Bravo clearance is heard.While it is not known what N1NR said in the last exchange, this is the nature of radio communications as some transmissions do not go through. Amelia McGillManagement & Program Analyst (FOIA Coordinator)FAA-Office of Foundational BusinessCorrespondence Services Branch, AFB-130424-405-7221. She didn't take the high road when he became argumentative. You don't get to tar the rest of us with his brush. The pilot was asked to leave, but decides to stay. He could have declared, he could have said he has a medical emergency, heck he could have said all sorts of things. About 45 minutes after the student left my phone rings How hard would it be to just clear him through? Karen: > Nobody gives a f*. The pilot of N731NR is a jerk, as well as an unsafe pilot that should not be flying. That being said, its not just a comfort level thing or willingness issue - its often a safety Im an air traffic controller in a class B airspace (one of the 8 US airports busier than LAS) and I have to admit that Im occasionally underwhelmed by the services that my coworkers are willing to provide; how unenthusiastic they can be about working a little harder to allow a VFR aircraft to enter the airspace. I'd always much rather be proactive and prevent a pilot deviation. This kind of thing gets people killed. 2) If he claims some kind of medical condition, goodbye medical certificate. ATC either turns him around or gives him a better heading. Its about attitude, and my only (very generous) defense of this pilots terrible attitude is that all of us are more tense and reactive these days with the covid pandemic, elections, riots, BLM, and other socio-political upheavals were dealing with globally. Maybe "Karen" is the fictitious name the ignorant/uncaring pilot in this story gave himself!? I was working the ER In Jerusalem and this belligerent teen was being kept there for observation post head trauma. saturn in ardra nakshatra pada 2 n731nr pilot deviation. That being said, its not just a comfort level thing or willingness issue - its often a safety judgement. They also rechecked the examiner who tested him on his private he got suspended for a short time and had to recheck as a examiner. This incident is recorded as all radio communications between planes and ATC are definitely recorded as a matter of public record:https://onemileatatime.com/atc-audio-negligent-pilot/. He busted that test and they pulled his ticket. Why Do They Cut the Back of Your Shirt When You First Fly Solo? People get frustrated in the air just like they do in cars and dont get their license suspended. 08:47PM EDT Montreal-Trudeau - YUL. They have your lives in their hands. The F-15 and F-16 have to go over twice that. Yes humans make mistakes, and that is why aviation has the strictest protocols outside Oh my gosh! PDF United States of America National Transportation Safety Board - Ntsb Watch how 731NR Decides to fly right into class bravo and not even care about it. He did not damage anybody. Either way, whether medical or psychological, the solution is the same - he shouldnt have a license. The FARs couldn't be more clear on this situation. Online Resource - Pilot Deviation Information: Flight and Ground There are riots. Due to the multiple violations including multiple times refusing to obey an ATC order, I am hoping the pilot's license is suspended at a minimum. I didn't hear anything that I didn't find out of line. Looks like he was below 6000 the whole time. The pilot violated the FARs and FSDO needs to take appropriate action. - entering B without explicit auth Even if he was previously allowed in the airspace, once told to get out, he has to go, no debate and certainly no defiance. Washington, DC 20591 Thank you for your attached FOIA request. Essentially, you have the right to be aware that you are in trouble after making a mistake. It appears that this pilot is a child of the "Magenta Line", it looks like he flies with automation on a lot. I remember about 20 years ago when my grandfather and I flew up to Vegas to SEMA and we flew outside class bravo and he explicitly explained that we dont get near that ring until ATC says clear to enter. Thank you for your very thoughtful insight. These guys & women keep 10-20 balls in the air constantly..you think you can do better??
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